[SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Ideas for things to add to the game

[SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby Monky » Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:38 am

Some things I would like to see;

Recruiting;
Descriptions/attributes added to the girls (not sure if male victims have same problem - have only seen the female side of it). It's strange that all the women seem to be B-cups of no description, although it seems the antiques collector, degradation slut, and okekai girl (SP?) all have at least a unique intro screen. I'd like to see some randomly generated body types, voluptuous, rail-thin, pear shaped, etc, and more unique characters as well.

Longer scenes for actions would be better for the player and probably less stressful on the server as it means more time between clicking that next ability.

The intro scene to start off would benefit from an actual minor dialogue with the character to size up their personality and start the lovin', and then some actions that you can tailor to affect starting lust/horror based on that info. Add in ways to benefit from horror as well, perhaps you get a horror extension if you have them cum while near max horror with certain transformations/equipment, or perhaps it opens up special moves like the lust meter does; like bondage, temporary self/victim transformations, dom stuff. The degradation slut can have those things trigger at certain lust levels instead of horror levels for flavor.

Managing;
Honestly, this part needs to be more engaging. It doesn't really seem to be anything more than choosing some transformations, getting apprentices and paring concubines with beasts. Firstly, the transformations are really limited. I don't understand why beasts have different transformations than concubines, and why you can't transform your apprentices. Maybe those are features that are coming, but I'd like to see a lot of different transformations that I can apply to anyone. Maybe apprentices benefit from an extra set of arms for fleshcrafting, but you can put them on beats/concubines too if it suits you. Don't be afraid to go extreme in what options are available, as that's the main draw of a game where you collect and twist your minions.

Second, it needs to stick out more. When a transformation progresses or completes, have a little bit of text for it and the minion's reactions, maybe even a test drive opportunity for the player that allows you to reap a little extra mana from them that turn or start your next encounter with a boost of some kind. Being able to do this intentionally, whenever you want without the benefit would also be great, but would need its own text and probably remove the consequences of the horror meter, or you can keep the horror meter effect and have each minion have a state of mind, you can push them to shattering or keep them content, depending on what pleases you, with possible consequences. Any possible art for the transformation sequence would be welcome, but I understand that takes a lot of resources.

The world outside;
It would be nice to have more to do than just go to city -> sex up someone and try to recruit them. Maybe a way to see what released minions are doing, different neighborhoods with different levels of suspicion/available transformations. A Night Club with a wildcard recruitment option and possible willing minions outside what you have now that provide a bonus of some sort. Like a bartender who, once recruited, can clue you in to drunk and horny patrons to take home or something, where a drunk person might have a much lower horror increase rate. This assumes you have the ability to hide your transformations of course. Exploring the mine is a great idea too, finding things like relics or even threats (like those damned pixies!) and being able to capture/manipulate them.

The pc ;
My only problem with the PC is just jumping straight to, say, FF breasts or a stallion cock etc. Adding in transformation time for the PC seems like a benefit to me and could improve the pace of the game. This was a large draw of CoC for me, seeing my character slowly transform, and occasionally having unexpected results.

That's all for now, thanks for the interesting game!
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby jackoekaki » Fri Mar 08, 2013 11:54 am

Monky wrote:Some things I would like to see;
Descriptions/attributes added to the girls (not sure if male victims have same problem - have only seen the female side of it). It's strange that all the women seem to be B-cups of no description, although it seems the antiques collector, degradation slut, and okekai girl (SP?) all have at least a unique intro screen. I'd like to see some randomly generated body types, voluptuous, rail-thin, pear shaped, etc, and more unique characters as well.


Yup, I plan to give the recruits varying body parts. The unique characters will have bodies that match their descriptions. In the crowdfunding I promised to do at least 18 unique characters and it won't be too far off before the writers start working on that.


Monky wrote:Add in ways to benefit from horror as well, perhaps you get a horror extension if you have them cum while near max horror with certain transformations/equipment, or perhaps it opens up special moves like the lust meter does; like bondage, temporary self/victim transformations, dom stuff. The degradation slut can have those things trigger at certain lust levels instead of horror levels for flavor.


Opening up options at high levels of horror would be a neat game mechanic, but I can't think of a good example that doesn't stray into coercive rapey territory.


Monky wrote:Firstly, the transformations are really limited. I don't understand why beasts have different transformations than concubines, and why you can't transform your apprentices. Maybe those are features that are coming, but I'd like to see a lot of different transformations that I can apply to anyone. Maybe apprentices benefit from an extra set of arms for fleshcrafting, but you can put them on beats/concubines too if it suits you. Don't be afraid to go extreme in what options are available, as that's the main draw of a game where you collect and twist your minions.


The concubines and beasts have different sets of transformations mainly for thematic reasons. Concubines have vaguely cum-production related things, beasts have milking and defence related things. To be honest I'm not satisfied with the selection at the moment either. Still figuring out what I want to change.


Monky wrote:It would be nice to have more to do than just go to city -> sex up someone and try to recruit them. Maybe a way to see what released minions are doing, different neighborhoods with different levels of suspicion/available transformations. Exploring the mine is a great idea too, finding things like relics or even threats (like those damned pixies!) and being able to capture/manipulate them.


Organising content into locations is something I'll think about when I have enough content to do that! :) If I did that now I'd have a bunch of identical places, so it's quite a ways off.
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby Monky » Sat Mar 09, 2013 9:17 am

Fair points on all, and yes you do have to avoid the coercive rapey stuff (something I didn't like about a lot of other games), willingness is essential.

Some people however do get off on horror or fear or control of another, and the horror meter is a great possibility for that. Personally, I like mental/psychic dom stuff, kind of like the illusion spell you have.

Just some ideas off the top of my head;

At 15 points of horror, open up a bondage theme if the PC has a rope and/or riding crop. This allows higher lust gains during higher levels of horror. The potential recruit of course can get away if you go too high on the horror meter like normal. When specifically using 'bondage sex', both horror and lust rise really fast, so it is a risky move if the bars are uneven. The exact number of points is alterable of course to what you feel is appropriate. This gives a reason to both use and not use illusion - you want to keep above a certain threshold to keep the lust gains, but you have to nuke the horror meter down if it gets too high.

At 30 points of horror (or whatever you feel appropriate, not sure on the exact horror points scale so i'm throwing out a number!), transform self or victim ; if you transform the victim, their minimum lust and horror are raised for the rest of the encounter, but mana gained from cumming increases. If you transform yourself, minimum horror increases, but your moves create more lust, no extra mana gained - both require a hefty mana sum. Transformations would be things like swelling breasts, growing cocks/extra cocks, tentacles, you could roll the 'loosen anus/vagina' into this, lactation, inflation, shrink/giant, etc. Lots of options. It should definitely have strong drawbacks of course as most normal people would be terrified - but hey they DID summon a succubus/incubus/omnibus. transformations of this sort, pre soul-deal of course, are temporary and only as long as the subject isn't outright resistant (ie; if they horror meter maxes, the transformation reverts and they escape).

Also, just as a note, fisting seems ridiculously powerful. Loosen + fist at anywhere near lust max and I never run out of mana and can recruit in 1 turn almost always. You might reduce the multiplier at least a little bit, maybe 2.5x. I support the idea of an orgasm finisher, but the full mana bar you almost always get removes a lot of the balance.
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby Shadow Knight » Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:36 am

Monky wrote:Also, just as a note, fisting seems ridiculously powerful. Loosen + fist at anywhere near lust max and I never run out of mana and can recruit in 1 turn almost always. You might reduce the multiplier at least a little bit, maybe 2.5x. I support the idea of an orgasm finisher, but the full mana bar you almost always get removes a lot of the balance.


Meh, I don't really consider it too much of a problem, since I don't even use fisting anymore. After the sixth or eighth Loosen spells, you can get a lot more mana using a penis (though that might be an advantage of stallion cocks. If so, that's actually pretty clever).

Also, eventually the horror metre is going to outpace the rate at which you can fill up the lust metre. Now granted, if you're a good player, you will seduce the mortal before that happens, but then again that's the entire point of the game. If you ignore the Seduce command, it doesn't really matter if you get a full mana metre every time you make the mortal orgasm, there will always be a point where you won't manage to reach the end of the lust metre on time (and Reveal Nature has some clear diminishing returns that make it pretty difficult to use more than 3 or 4 times).
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby Monky » Mon Mar 11, 2013 7:12 am

What I'm seeing is, I cast loosen vagina to open, then fist lights up as an option. From there, I use my mana to reduce horror with illusion and sex as normal. I then do what I can to max out lust before horror gets close to the cap. Horror almost never overflows unless I cause an orgasm on accident with a move other than fist which robs me of mana for the next phase, and I don't really have to use reveal nature in most cases (the antiques collector is one of them that requires one or two). Even with it, it still fills up enough mana to clear out the horror meter in time for an orgasm. Mana increasing items/transformations also play into this in what is currently the late game.

Just my observations.
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby Shadow Knight » Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:09 am

Yeah, that's kind of how you should be playing the game. What I was saying was that, if you never use the Seduce move, eventually the lust metre will be too big for you to fill without overflowing the horror metre, even after spending all your mana. The trick is, of course, using the Seduce move before that happens. And like I said, fisting isn't the only way to completely refill the mana metre, you can do that with a penis (and probably a strap-on) and several castings of the Loosen spell.

In general, the ease at which you succeed depends primarily on the size of your mana metre. The bigger it is, the more mana you have to cast Illusion (as we're assuming that filling the mana metre on every orgasm is the norm), and that's the factor that influences how easily you succeed. If you don't get the late-game transformations and piercings, you will find the end-game mortals pretty hard. A potential solution to this (and a way to avoid making players feel they HAVE to get transformations they don't like in order to stay competitive) is to make it so that every so often (every 10 mortals or so), there's a lower-difficulty mortal. So if you want to skip on the end-game mana boosts, you can still just reject mortals until you find an easier one.

Though if that's implemented, making the harder difficulties even harder (that is, requiring more minimum lust to succeed on the Seduce move) would also solve the problem of refilling the mana metre. If you make the last bit of the Indecisive attitude require a LOT of minimum lust to have even a Slim chance of success, reaching that point without overflowing the mana metre is going to be quite the challenge.
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby jackoekaki » Tue Mar 12, 2013 10:15 am

The other option is to nerf loosen itself, so that training the orifice isn't quite as cheap and instant. I don't want to render big cocks a liability with new characters, so it'd still need to be readily available, but I could make it so stacking it causes diminishing returns.

Also, I had thought about making Fist a 2x multiplier and saving the 3x multiplier for some kind of electro stim device.
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby Shadow Knight » Tue Mar 12, 2013 11:30 am

jackoekaki wrote:The other option is to nerf loosen itself, so that training the orifice isn't quite as cheap and instant. I don't want to render big cocks a liability with new characters, so it'd still need to be readily available, but I could make it so stacking it causes diminishing returns.

Also, I had thought about making Fist a 2x multiplier and saving the 3x multiplier for some kind of electro stim device.


Ehhh, I dunno, I really like getting massive amounts of lust after about 6 or 8 Loosen spells and a massive cock. That is pretty damn awesome (and a great reward for both spending so much mana on Loosen and having the big cock mutation itself). What you could do would be to make the lust gain a lot smaller for bigger cocks without enough Loosen, so that you are encouraged to cast the spell repeatedly (sinking mana that you could otherwise pour into Illusion or a vibrator) and keep fist as an alternative for people who don't have huge cocks or strap-ons.

Nerfing fisting to 2x and using something else for 3x could work, yeah, but I always imagined electro-stim working like the vibrator (+lust, -mana per turn). Maybe a specific spot stimulation instead? Prostate massage for guys and G-spot massaging for women?
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby xDiabolica » Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:40 pm

I like your ideas for the action in the city!
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby Morg » Thu May 02, 2013 2:33 pm

I am having a blast with this game if you could add an area of the city you explore to find special recruits. Inside perhaps find some encounters to hinder you like a witch hunter or an Angel. Stored research could be used to create illusions or charms to defeat them as you are not a combat demon.

Another thought I had is research could be used as a resource for some ritual magics, like Increasing lust city wide, banishing a rival that is stealing those you failed recruit or corrupting the city to increase the number of recruits that summon you. I would require a mana cost and in some cases an upkeep in addition to the research cost
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby HypnoKitten » Sat May 18, 2013 3:29 am

Its really interesting to think about the 'new areas without rapey' paradox, but if that is an issue there is a possible suggestion.. (keeping in mind the game is currently about seducing mortals, stealing their souls, turning them into monsters, and them having those monsters kill intruders - and nope, don't have a problem with any of that :) )

So the current 'non-rapey' issue is currently gotten around because the humans call you do them. Soooo why not just keeping on playing on that? In those areas you sense the people who are 'wavering' (someone who just read '50 shades of gray' for the first time and is going to the local dungeon) / 'in big need of a little something something' (the guy at the club who became a dj just to get girls and none are paying any attention to him) / 'bad' (ie tracking down whoever society considers to be doing bad things - crack dealers, thieves) / 'need rescuing' (a prostitute wanting to get away from her abusive pimp) / and so on and so on?


(Oh, as for the whole nerfing thing, honestly I think the game is currently a the point where it needs more content and variety rather than number balancing, those numbers will change anyway depending on what content you add. Much as I like a challenge, this isn't the kind of game I think of when I think 'I want to fight and overcome Whatever It Can Throw at Me')
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby jackoekaki » Sun May 19, 2013 7:15 am

HypnoKitten wrote:Its really interesting to think about the 'new areas without rapey' paradox, but if that is an issue there is a possible suggestion.. (keeping in mind the game is currently about seducing mortals, stealing their souls, turning them into monsters, and them having those monsters kill intruders - and nope, don't have a problem with any of that :) )


Personally I'm a lot more comfortable with fantastical magical villainy than villainy that people can execute IRL.

Morg wrote:Another thought I had is research could be used as a resource for some ritual magics, like Increasing lust city wide, banishing a rival that is stealing those you failed recruit or corrupting the city to increase the number of recruits that summon you. I would require a mana cost and in some cases an upkeep in addition to the research cost


This is a really interesting idea. Spike the city water supply with lust potion or something.
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby Shadow Knight » Mon May 20, 2013 12:13 am

jackoekaki wrote:Personally I'm a lot more comfortable with fantastical magical villainy than villainy that people can execute IRL.


Could not possibly agree more.
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Re: [SUGGESTION] A few things I'd like to see

Postby willpell » Tue Jun 03, 2014 1:57 am

HypnoKitten wrote:Much as I like a challenge, this isn't the kind of game I think of when I think 'I want to fight and overcome Whatever It Can Throw at Me')


Agreed. The game needs to be playable, but it hardly needs to be "fair", given that nobody is playing it against anyone else. Some players will enjoy being able to break the game in half with some absurd combo that makes every NPC surrender to them instantly, while others will want the challenge of an uphill battle, and still others will just want to collect fun "toys" and not care whether they "win" or "lose". Balance is not really necessary in a game meant to be played with one hand. :)
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